A current poll on the Bowling This Month web site has more than 70% of respondents stating that USBC does not do enought to support bowling as a sport. Considering the readership of BTM, mostly very serious bowlers, this says a great deal about the current perception of USBC's role in promoting bowling as a sport. So, what idea do you have to suggest to USBC about promoting bowling as a sport. This should include ideas for local, state as well as national efforts. Is it mandating tougher lane condition requirements (e.g., PBA patterns) or is it more challenging league formats? And, please keep the one-to-one dialog to a minimum on this thread. Let's make this useful to USBC by a list of creative out-of-the-box ideas. Best ideas only. Don't add for the sake of responding. If you have an interesting idea, then share it.
How do you feel about USBC's role as an advocate for the sport of bowling?Total votes since 2007-09-27: 131They try to do too much to promote the sport. (6 %)They do just the right amount to promote the sport. (21 %)They don't do enough to promote the sport. (73 %)
Ok I will give it a shot. A sport is about meeting and overcoming challenges. A sport is not about treating everyone as if they have accomplished something even though the accomplishment is not deemed respectable by ones peers. USBC should define what bowling is by lowering the scoring pace by any means necessary. The ability to make spares should be a lot more important than it currently is since that is bowling's equalivent to the short game. Skills should be more important than equipment that can be purchased. If you really want bowling to be a sport you first have to find a way to test the skill of the bowler rather than overcome it with products or cancel it with soft lane conditions.
Joe, It is my view that there is no simplistic solution and nearly as many things not to do as there are things to do.
Whatever is actually planned, in my opinion, needs to be one that has the promise of increased revenue for centers and other for profits who do business in bowling. For USBC to invoke a something or other sport condition as a one size fits all for everyone that bowls is an example of what should not be done.
As something that will take years in a baby step by baby step process, I think a way needs to be found to get those who are very good bowlers and those who want to be very good bowlers and treat bowling as a sport to get out of handicap recreational leagues/tournaments altogether. For those types to whine and complain about easy scoring conditions that the majority may enjoy, and not even do that much better on them, while collecting money from these very same men and women in brackets and pot games does a lot to help foster the lack of respect bowling has 'earned' as a sport.
Real athletes compete with their peers not with those that are not athletes. To earn respect as a sport there needs to be sport level leagues and tournaments at local levels,some of them qualifying men and women to go on to state, regional and national championships.
There needs to be something far different offered at entry levels for juniors where as skill levels rise good coaching and increased acitivities rise along with it.
Since scratch bowler athletes are a distinct minority they need more than just entry fees to support them in leagues and tournaments. To just expect centers and other for profits to just hand that support over as something they deserve is not likely to work all that well and my thought on this is for USBC/BPAA (and all other centers wishing to participate) to create and franchise new business leagues and tournaments for all levels of bowling with agreed upon fees set as a percentage of new income (maybe so much per game); my thought on a better way to handle junior bowling would be an example of something that could be controlled rather than the way it is now with individual centers pretty much doing or not doing whatever they please.
By using percentage of new business as a source of income a higher percentage of it could be used to support the sport of bowling activities without recreational bowlers involved in these franchised leagues/tournaments complaining all that much.
When I was running U.S. Open, Queens/Masters local qualifiers in Syracuse there were always far more men than women entrants. To get needed moneyh to support the women I would charge the going rate for bowling, even though I got it for far less, and use that money to support the women and the men never even knew I was doing it; I also moved the women directly into match play which saved them the costs of qualifying games that the men had with all those games helping out the women.
Don Gates
prunenow:Joe, It is my view that there is no simplistic solution and nearly as many things not to do as there are things to do. Whatever is actually planned, in my opinion, needs to be one that has the promise of increased revenue for centers and other for profits who do business in bowling. For USBC to invoke a something or other sport condition as a one size fits all for everyone that bowls is an example of what should not be done. As something that will take years in a baby step by baby step process, I think a way needs to be found to get those who are very good bowlers and those who want to be very good bowlers and treat bowling as a sport to get out of handicap recreational leagues/tournaments altogether. For those types to whine and complain about easy scoring conditions that the majority may enjoy, and not even do that much better on them, while collecting money from these very same men and women in brackets and pot games does a lot to help foster the lack of respect bowling has 'earned' as a sport. Real athletes compete with their peers not with those that are not athletes. To earn respect as a sport there needs to be sport level leagues and tournaments at local levels,some of them qualifying men and women to go on to state, regional and national championships. There needs to be something far different offered at entry levels for juniors where as skill levels rise good coaching and increased acitivities rise along with it. Since scratch bowler athletes are a distinct minority they need more than just entry fees to support them in leagues and tournaments. To just expect centers and other for profits to just hand that support over as something they deserve is not likely to work all that well and my thought on this is for USBC/BPAA (and all other centers wishing to participate) to create and franchise new business leagues and tournaments for all levels of bowling with agreed upon fees set as a percentage of new income (maybe so much per game); my thought on a better way to handle junior bowling would be an example of something that could be controlled rather than the way it is now with individual centers pretty much doing or not doing whatever they please. By using percentage of new business as a source of income a higher percentage of it could be used to support the sport of bowling activities without recreational bowlers involved in these franchised leagues/tournaments complaining all that much. When I was running U.S. Open, Queens/Masters local qualifiers in Syracuse there were always far more men than women entrants. To get needed moneyh to support the women I would charge the going rate for bowling, even though I got it for far less, and use that money to support the women and the men never even knew I was doing it; I also moved the women directly into match play which saved them the costs of qualifying games that the men had with all those games helping out the women. Don Gates
Bowling doesn't just need to be SUPPORTED as a sport. It needs to be PROMOTED as a sport -- not just something to do in conjunction with a birthday party or something to do when listening to music in a "cosmic lighting" environment.
Bill, agree, but before you can do that you need to have the bowlers deserving to be called athletes and the activities for them to bowl in.
prunenow:Bill, agree, but before you can do that you need to have the bowlers deserving to be called athletes and the activities for them to bowl in. Don Gates
Bowlers = Athletes
Gimme a break!
I agree with Don Gates when he states that there is no simple solution. When he stated that there are as many thing not to do as there are things to do I can only think about how the last 25+ years since the scoring explosion began have affected the way bowing is viewed as well as the number of participants. Baby steps are all that we have been taking ever since we made the giant leap with the first reactive resin ball Don. We can baby step as long as you like until we run completely out of members because membership has most certainly been baby stepping with us.
Tell me Don, why does it bother you so that certain individuals might enjoy entering brackets even though they might lose the majority of the time? No one is forcing them to enter you know. They do so of their own free will. They enter because they want to play for money in spite of being ill equipped with the proper skills to do so effectively. They think that the handicapping system is keeping the field equal, but it cannot eqalize the inbalance created when an invisible advantage is given to those with the knowledge and skill needed to manipulate it. Are they being hustled? Of course they are, but it is the greedy businessman that is hustling them with his promises that the handicapping system works in their favor.
There is something that is offered to juniors near their 16th birthday that bowling will never be able to compete with, and anyone who does not remember it themselves is truely a fossil.
Scratch bowlers may indeed be the minority, but that minority has an incredible amount of influence over the majority. To expect the minority to leave the fertile feeding grounds provided by the majority without any incentives to do so might not work at all, and with incentives it might not work so well, but we all know that the biggest losers here will eventually be the businessmen who created the problem to begin with.
Skullpants, I pretty much agree with you that bowling has been taking baby steps in the wrong direction for a long time and perhaps there is no way to halt the contiuance of those baby steps in the wrong direction. Certainly hind sight can point out many places in the of history of bowling where doing something different could have made a big difference.
Right from the beginning it was a big mistake to have separate local associations for men, women and juniors, a mistake to have so many one center associations, a mistake to have elected officers by a minority who serve as officers, line officers, presidents and active life members for decades and do it all with only officers serving on committees, a mistake to have thousands of delegates spending a couple of hours on a Friday afternoon to make important decisions on the future of bowling, a mistake to have urethane replace lacquer with no good way to dress it, a mistake to have urethane balls introduced, a mistake to have resin balls introduced, mistake to have creative 'legal' dodo ball manipulations of weight blocks, a mistake to enforce gutter to gutter even distribution lane conditioning and non discernible blend on urethane surfaces, a mistake to allow sky rocketing of scores with 26', 24' and 3 unit rules that quieted a storm but hurt bowling's credibility, a mistake not have bowling centers, other for profits and local volunteers working together at local and national levels right from the git go with the right folks paying the bills, and that's just the tip of an iceberg worth of mistakes.
With all of that bowling has little choice but to try and make do and find a way to survive and thrive. If bowling had been able to 'blow things up' as was needed and begin with a clean slate of new ways to do things there might have been a better chance to succeed but the lousy system bowling is saddled with made that impossible to achieve and even with the fancy name change from ABC/WIBC/YABA to USBC at local levels not all that much has changed.
As for why does it bother me if scratch bowlers feed on lesser skilled in leagues and tournaments it is just because I just think there should be fairness with scratch bowlers duking it out with their peers not with lesser skilled if they want respect as athletes. There was years and years of negative reactions at national conventions to creating a classified doubles and singles division and maybe you, Skullpants, was one of the feeders who was really upset when the 180 and under non cashing donators all of a sudden got a chance to win a little money. You likely would also be very unhappy if those lower average participants got their own division for brackets and pot games.
As lucrative as it is for USBC I think if they are really interested in promoting bowling as a sport they need to find a way to separate those who want recognition as athletes with more activities on testing conditions from competing in recreational handicap leagues and tournaments and I agree without incetives those who want recognition as athletes will be reluctant to give up the easy money they get from brackets and pot game while competing with lesser skilled who are willing to hope they get lucky, like to gamble, but are mostly feeders not winners.
The best way for USBC to support the Sport of bowling is by having goals for bowlers to reach. The goal for a person that thinks of bowling as a sport should be to become a professional. The thing that USBC has to come up with is the motivation for a person just getting into the game to want to become a professional or at least a better bowler. Now just what is that motivation going to be? Money or status among your peers? I believe the money wins here. If I were talking 50 years ago maybe status among your peers would have won out. As a kid your goal as a junior bowler was to be the best junior and then move up into the adult leagues and become the best in the leagues you bowled in hoping that someone would take notice of you and ask you to join one of the Classic leagues and then again working hard at your game and keeping your fingers crossed hoping that someone in the All-Star league would notice you and ask you on one of there teams. The things I just talked about were not programs that were offered by ABC. The bowlers were self motivated and knew the only way to get better was to get the best together. These Classic and All-Star leagues started out small but after a short period of time people were waiting in line to get into them. Many of those that did bowl in the All-Star leagues went on to become professionals.
We've had threads on here about Tiered leagues which were very interesting and just might be the answer to the future of the sport of bowling. The Sports bowling/PBA experience leauges have started out slow but just may be the answer if USBC could come up with some way of showcasing these bowlers with maybe some kind of tournament at the end of each year that only bowlers competing in these leagues could participate in. Of course these leagues would be the top tier of a tiered system.
E. Chase
I truely believe that a tiered league would work well, but only if there were in place the correct incentives for members to want to ascend to the upper levels. Let's face it, a player would be temped to sandbag in order to remain in the lower level if moving to the upper level meant that he would have to face tougher competition in a much smaller field which also means less rewards and of course a higher cost at upper levels as was proposed much like what we see in sport bowling today. This is exactly opposite of the way it should be. Incentives like lowered costs for upper level members would go a long way towards making tiered membership possible. Anyone who believes that the masses in the lower levels should not support the minority in the upper levels should just be satisfied with what we now have because that is all you will likely ever see regardless of what you offer.
Skullpants, I agree that higher average bowlers need incentives and because there is the potential for them to be role models deserve more support to get them to participate, not as much but the kind of support needed for professional bowlers who also have the potential to be role models and helpful in the promotion of bowling at local levels but are not being used or their star quality enhanced.
However, just asking for reduced costs for league and open play bowling or expecting added money for tournaments is not likely to fly. In previous posts I suggested a partnership of USBC/BPAA (and other centers) in establishing a division to promote and run franchised leagues and tournaments that produce new revenue and get a piece of that revenue to pay the costs and provide marketing and money that can be added to prize funds.
I mentioned junior bowling as a good place to start with a program that actually teaches boys and girls the basics then offers increased activities and better coaching as skill levels rise. The activities just at center level for entry level bowlers and progressing to area wide, state wide and nation wide for those whose skill levels increase. Something like this needs a central control, working through individual centers who do their own thing would never work.
If this was all new business and there was a rebate based on lineage with bowling centers obligated only if they were successful they should be easier to get them to participate than it would be to ask for money up front and hope for the best. With something like this it would open the possiblity of omore revenue from things like instructional tapes, bowling shirts, etal.
The same could work for adult bowling with franchised Sport leagues for various skill levels and local, state, national tournament opportunities as skill levels rise and all this new business generating income that could support prize funds.
It doesn't have to be just sport leagues, either, I think a franchised system for senior bowlers could work well, expanding on what already exists for senior with non certified senior gathering to bowl three games with colored pins and no averages transformed into keeping those averages and offering other activities where averages are needed; the internet used to provide information on where seniors can bowl while they are traveling and many do spend their summers and winters in different locals.
Skullpants, the internet could be used to promote, keep track of league and tournament scoring and keep everyone honest if a percentage of income from lineage was the basis for rebates. With something like this it would be possible to have the masses helping provide support for the minority and no mind doing it.
echase:The best way for USBC to support the Sport of bowling is by having goals for bowlers to reach. The goal for a person that thinks of bowling as a sport should be to become a professional. The thing that USBC has to come up with is the motivation for a person just getting into the game to want to become a professional or at least a better bowler. Now just what is that motivation going to be? Money or status among your peers? I believe the money wins here. If I were talking 50 years ago maybe status among your peers would have won out. As a kid your goal as a junior bowler was to be the best junior and then move up into the adult leagues and become the best in the leagues you bowled in hoping that someone would take notice of you and ask you to join one of the Classic leagues and then again working hard at your game and keeping your fingers crossed hoping that someone in the All-Star league would notice you and ask you on one of there teams. The things I just talked about were not programs that were offered by ABC. The bowlers were self motivated and knew the only way to get better was to get the best together. These Classic and All-Star leagues started out small but after a short period of time people were waiting in line to get into them. Many of those that did bowl in the All-Star leagues went on to become professionals.
Dear Earl:
Your observations (of days gone by) are solid. But now, obviously, though many, many people carry much, much higher averages (and roll so many more honor scores), there are NOT the same incentives to improve and get better. Just let the proprietors and the lane men provide their all-timportant "help."
Indeed it is true that highly skilled bowlers are role models for the rest. They can be good role models or they can be not so good role models. That choice is up to them. While I am sure that business owners might prefer that they be good role models, why should they be expected to support a system that shows them little or no support?
I am not asking for anything Don. I am telling you what might work and what will not work from my particular point of view. I simply will not just be a consumer for the businessman to exploit. I do not intend to pay $6 a line so that I can bowl for a coupon that entitles me to a 25 cent dicount on the purchase of a Big Mac. I am all for the seperation of bowlers into skill levels as long as the potential rewards for excellence outweigh the costs, but if not then that too will not fly.
Do what you want with junior bowlers. Eventually they are going to reach an age where they will have to move up and then they will have to deal with people like me. Let us hope that they are prepared.
No Don. No rebates. This is a problem that the businessman is going to have to find a way to deal with if he wants bowling to grow. The businessman created the problem when he removed the challenge from the game and created the imbalance that does not allow the new player the oppor
